作者AlbertSpeer (德国军备部长)
看板Warfare
标题[讨论] 小巨角战役
时间Tue Nov 3 16:05:27 2015
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Little_Bighorn
英文wiki简介
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2UzKRUgzJ0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60yLVrhksWk
相关影片
1876年 美军骑兵中校乔治卡斯特率领部下211人奇袭印地安苏族营地 该营地有印地安战
士两千五百人 但卡斯特未经侦查就贸然轻骑贸进 结果迅速被兵力占优势的苏族战士全面
包围夹攻 造成其与属下在几十分钟内全数阵亡 无一生还
英文wiki的一段叙述:
The precise details of Custer's fight are largely conjectural since none of
his men (the five companies under his immediate command) survived the battle.
The accounts of surviving Indians are conflicting and unclear.
While the gunfire heard on the bluffs by Reno and Benteen's men was probably
from Custer's fight, the soldiers on Reno Hill were unaware of what had
happened to Custer until General Terry's arrival on June 27. They were
reportedly stunned by the news. When the army examined the Custer battle
site, soldiers could not determine fully what had transpired. Custer's force
of roughly 210 men had been engaged by the Lakota and Northern Cheyenne about
3.5 miles (6 km) to the north. Evidence of organized resistance included
apparent breastworks made of dead horses on Custer Hill.[33] By this time,
the Lakota and Cheyenne had already removed most of their dead from the
field. The soldiers identified the 7th Cavalry's dead as best as possible and
hastily buried them where they fell. By the time troops came to recover the
bodies, they found most of the dead stripped of their clothing, ritually
mutilated, and in an advanced state of decomposition, making identification
of many impossible.[35]
Custer was found with shots to the left chest and left temple. Either wound
would have been fatal, though he appeared to have bled from only the chest
wound, meaning his head wound may have been delivered post-mortem. He also
suffered a wound to the arm. Some Lakota oral histories assert that Custer
committed suicide to avoid capture and subsequent torture, though this is
usually discounted since the wounds were inconsistent with his known
right-handedness. (Other Native accounts note several soldiers committing
suicide near the end of the battle.)[citation needed] His body was found near
the top of Custer Hill, which also came to be known as "Last Stand Hill."
There the United States erected a tall memorial obelisk inscribed with the
names of the 7th Cavalry's casualties.[35]
Several days after the battle, Curley, Custer's Crow scout who had left
Custer near Medicine Tail Coulee, recounted the battle, reporting that Custer
had attacked the village after attempting to cross the river. He was driven
back, retreating toward the hill where his body was found.[36] As the
scenario seemed compatible with Custer's aggressive style of warfare and with
evidence found on the ground, it was the basis of many popular accounts of
the battle.
According to Pretty Shield, the wife of Goes-Ahead (another Crow scout for
the 7th Cavalry), Custer was killed while crossing the river: "...and he died
there, died in the water of the Little Bighorn, with Two-bodies, and the blue
soldier carrying his flag".[37]:136 In this account, Custer was allegedly
killed by a Lakota called Big-nose.[37]:141 However, in Chief Gall's version
of events, as recounted to Lt. Edward Settle Godfrey, Custer did not attempt
to ford the river and the nearest that he came to the river or village was
his final position on the ridge.[24]:380 Chief Gall's statements were
corroborated by other Indians, notably the wife of Spotted Horn Bull.[24]:379
Given that no bodies of men or horses were found anywhere near the ford,
Godfrey himself concluded "that Custer did not go to the ford with any body
of men".[24]:380
Cheyenne oral tradition credits Buffalo Calf Road Woman with striking the
blow that knocked Custer off his horse before he died
以往美国都把此役当成像阿拉漠那样壮烈成仁的传奇案例 但是经检视战场以及听印地安
苏族方面的口述历史来看 反而比较像是贸然推进中伏全灭 且对印地安族的名誉回复
也积极推行 所以传奇色彩消失殆尽 电影"We were Soilder"角色就对於卡斯特评价甚差
感想:
乔治卡斯特的确是美国版的牟田口廉也无误 然而害死快六万下属的牟田口还恬不知耻
的活了很多年 害死两百多下属的卡斯特当场阵亡 算起来不怎麽有天理
--
"除了公敌,我没有敌人"
---法国贤相黎胥留临终遗言
--
※ 发信站: 批踢踢实业坊(ptt.cc), 来自: 101.13.67.238
※ 文章网址: https://webptt.com/cn.aspx?n=bbs/Warfare/M.1446537933.A.A82.html
※ 编辑: AlbertSpeer (101.13.67.238), 11/03/2015 16:11:42
1F:推 wittmann4213: 毛泽东史达林还不是寿终正寝,讲什麽天理太可笑 11/03 16:22
2F:→ wittmann4213: 卡斯特是脑冲自己在场当然就被婊死,牟田口又不是。 11/03 16:23
3F:推 s952013: ATARI有款卡斯特的复仇,超鸟的游戏 11/03 16:24
4F:→ AlbertSpeer: 我个人情感上较同情印地安人 但是照当时局面印地安人 11/03 16:27
5F:→ AlbertSpeer: 被赶进保留区而失去传统与原住地已经是大势所趋 11/03 16:28
※ 编辑: AlbertSpeer (101.13.67.238), 11/03/2015 16:36:25
6F:→ wittmann4213: 印地安人没有工业背景支撑,被消灭是必然的,不过大 11/03 16:37
7F:→ wittmann4213: 小角战役时,记得印地安人用的枪比美国骑兵的好。 11/03 16:37
8F:→ AlbertSpeer: 实际上印地安人没被消灭 他们被赶进保留区 那是一段 11/03 16:39
9F:→ AlbertSpeer: 血泪史 所以现在美国政府就用开赌场等优惠补偿他们 11/03 16:40
10F:→ AlbertSpeer: 但跟印地安人当时的颠沛流离比....嗯..... 11/03 16:40
11F:→ AlbertSpeer: 记得印地安人就常常拿货物去贸易站换枪枝弹药 11/03 16:41
12F:推 wittmann4213: 印地安人用的亨利来福枪射速远比美军用的春田卡宾快 11/03 16:44
13F:推 yoyodio: 卡斯特此役堪比武田元繁…… 11/03 16:59
14F:推 kevin55l: 印地安人有尖啸+10射速 (大误) 11/03 17:27
15F:推 clickslither: 牟田口是盟军之友...当然有资格得到善终 11/03 18:14
16F:推 zeumax: 哪个保留区开赌场有漏洞,就有纯白人取得身份开赌场 11/03 18:14
17F:推 tony3366211: 原住民枪还比较好,还有苏族夏安族,同族都不是团结 11/03 18:41
18F:→ tony3366211: 的联盟,是殖民者太过份,让他们团结一致,不然卡斯 11/03 18:41
19F:→ tony3366211: 特的部队,原本分散的原住民,可能真的不是对手。 11/03 18:41
20F:推 a7v333: 玩世纪帝国3 剧情有这关 11/03 19:48
21F:推 Inkthink: 同楼上 印象中那关有一大堆骑兵 11/03 19:57
22F:→ chuckni: 怎麽会拿牟田口来比.... 11/03 20:39
23F:→ AlbertSpeer: 因为都有勇无谋啊 11/03 20:57
24F:推 makoto888: 牟田口那不是有勇无谋,根本是少了脑子吧 11/03 21:13
25F:推 g3sg1: Lesley J. McNair算西线德军之友吗? 坚持用反战车炮的人 11/03 21:32
26F:推 RACINGHEART: 为什麽印地安人的枪比美军的枪好啊? 11/04 00:07
27F:推 suaowilliam: 因为印地安人是自费买枪,美军的则是公发品 11/04 00:20
28F:→ suaowilliam: 军队采购武器通常要求的不是最好,而是便宜量大... 11/04 00:21
29F:→ goetze: 小时後还看过神化卡斯特的电影~那时觉得很帅~现在就.. 11/04 10:41
30F:→ captainprice: 那种神话殖民者的电影就我看来跟日本人拍陆战队在 11/04 10:44
31F:→ captainprice: 上海多神勇一样 是种充满优越感傲慢心态的吹嘘 11/04 10:45
32F:推 su281: 苏族用的温彻特步枪比美国骑兵用的活门步枪装弹量大射速快~ 11/04 17:04
33F:→ su281: 战後一直想省子弹的美军高层被骂翻,才有新的春田步枪列装~~ 11/04 17:07
34F:→ saltlake: 看来印地安人跟当年的大清一样只想师夷长技以制夷 11/04 17:33