作者scju (QQ)
看板Eng-Class
标题[请益] 英语论坛中，对ever lived的回应
时间Thu Feb 22 22:36:51 2018
各位好，请教一下
在英语论坛中问了一个问题：
https://www.usingenglish.com/forum/threads/259512-ever-lived-has-ever-lived
She's one of the greatest writers who ever lived.
It was one of the largest animals that has ever lived.
http://learnersdictionary.com/definition/live
------------
1. Do 'ever lived' and 'has/have ever lived' mean the same thing?
2. Are they interchangeable?
网友teechar回应：
1. Yes, they do.
2. They are in contexts such as the above.
网友Tdol回应：
With the first sentence, I would use "has ever lived" because she is still
alive, but don't think that the past tense is an error.
我问Tdol：
How do we know that she is still alive?
Is it possible that she is dead?
Tdol回应：
Without further context, "She's" suggests that she is alive. This is an issue
with trying to force meanings out of decontextualised standalone sentences.
The logical conclusion from yur sentence is that she's alive. If this were a
text about Jane Austen that used the present tense, things could be
different, but with a name and a context, the logical position is to assume
she's alive.
----------
想请问：
1.This is an issue
with trying to force meanings out of decontextualised standalone sentences.
这句话该怎麽理解呢？
a.「这是一个试图『强迫意义脱离没有脉络的独立句子』的问题」？
（句型是force XXX out of decontextualised standalone sentences）
b.「这是一个试图『强加意义在已脱离脉络的独立句子』的问题」？
（句型是force meanings (which are) out of decontextualised standalone
sentences）
2.If this were a
text about Jane Austen that used the present tense, things could be
different, but with a name and a context, the logical position is to assume
she's alive.
这句话也不太懂，前半部是说，如果描述Jane Austen这种名作家，虽然她已死了，
但还是可以用she is...的意思吗？
後半部，with a name and a context,
the logical position is to assume she's alive.
「如果有一个名字和一个语意脉络，逻辑位置会是假设她还活着」（什麽意思？）
请教各位，谢谢。
--
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※ 编辑: scju (111.251.45.196), 02/22/2018 22:38:55
1F：→ dunchee: dunchee.blogspot.com/2016/09/tmp2.html 02/22 23:35
2F：推 l10nel: 这是试图对脱离脉络的独立句子强加意义所造成的问题/困难 02/23 01:56
3F：推 l10nel: 虽然Austen一死，但关於她的句子，有的可以使用现在式is， 02/23 02:02
4F：→ l10nel: 一死->已死 02/23 02:07
5F：→ l10nel: 尤其那种超越生死的历史评价如Austen IS the greatest... 02/23 02:08
6F：→ wohtp: "force something out of"： 硬挤牙膏挤出来 02/23 10:37
7F：→ wohtp: 所以直接翻译成「从没有脉络的独立句子中挤出涵义」 02/23 10:38
8F：推 EVASUKA: It was one of the largest animals that has ever lived 02/23 14:32
9F：→ EVASUKA: 这句没有讨论吗? 时态上应该有待讨论的地方 02/23 14:32
网友teechar说
这里的'ever lived' and 'has/have ever lived'可以互换....。
所以应该没有时态的问题吧？（我目前是这样认为啦）
10F：→ kaifrankwind: logical 有合逻辑 合理的意思 会稍微衍生 02/23 20:16
感谢各位回应！
※ 编辑: scju (111.251.45.196), 02/23/2018 21:59:30
11F：推 EVASUKA: 我是好奇was和has lived搭配背後的逻辑 02/24 10:48
12F：推 eschew: has lived表示包括所从古至今有的动物 02/24 12:55
13F：→ eschew: was表示这种动物已经绝种 02/24 12:55
14F：推 EVASUKA: 如果是从古至今所有动物，应该用have lived? 02/24 14:26
15F：→ sunny1991225: 楼上说的那个是gmat的经典考法之一... 02/24 14:40
16F：→ sunny1991225: 主要是看你到底在修饰是one还是animals 02/24 14:40
17F：→ sunny1991225: 这种单数名词再用介系词接复数的用法很容易让人搞 02/24 14:41
18F：→ sunny1991225: 错子句的修饰对象 02/24 14:41
19F：推 EVASUKA: 所以我才说这句有讨论空间，前後时态组合和单复数组合 02/24 14:42
20F：→ EVASUKA: 上有不同意思，目前原波那句我看起来是不够清楚的... 02/24 14:42