原文來源： https://udn.com/news/story/124870/9506652 原文摘要： 美國總統川普接受福斯新聞主播拜爾（Bret Baier）專訪15日播出，川普表示，他不希望有 人走向獨立。川普向台灣與中國雙方發出警告，提醒台北方面不要期待，一旦因自身行動引 發戰爭，美國會無條件提供軍事支持。 以下為兩人在談到台灣議題時的中英文對照。 福斯新聞主播拜爾： I want to ask you about Iran and AI. But China made clear that Taiwan is very im portant to them and after your first meeting here, President Xi's spokesman put out a statement through the media, saying this: The Taiwan question is the most important issue in China-U.S. relations. If it is handled properly, the bilatera l relationship will enjoy overall stability. Otherwise, the two country will hav e clashes and even conflicts, putting the entire relationship in great jeopardy. You were still inside the meeting when that came out. That sounded almost like a threat. Was it communicated that way behind closed doors? 我想問你關於伊朗與AI的問題。但中國已明確表示，台灣對他們非常重要。在你第一次會談 後，習近平的發言人透過媒體發表聲明稱：「台灣問題是中美關係中最重要的問題。如果處 理得當，雙邊關係將維持整體穩定；否則，兩國將出現衝突甚至對抗，使整體關係陷入極大 危險。」 當這份聲明發布時，你人還在會議裡。那聽起來幾乎像是一種威脅。閉門會談時也是這樣傳 達的嗎？ 美國總統川普： No, it wasn't. Not at all. It has always been their most important issue. It's n ot a takeover. They will just don't want to see this place, we will call it a pl ace because nobody knows how to define it, but they don't want to see it go inde pendent. They don't want to do it. And I think they probably would do somethingp retty harsh and then they would be met harshly and bad things will happen. It's not that. We talked -- by the way, last night we talked the whole night about th at issue. I think I know more about Taiwan right now than I know about almost an y country. 川普：不，不是。完全不是。這一直都是他們最重要的問題。這不是什麼「接管」問題。他 們只是不想看到這個地方——我們就稱它為一個地方吧，因為沒人知道該怎麼定義——走向 獨立。他們不希望那樣。我認為，如果真的發生那種情況，他們很可能會採取相當強硬的行 動，也會遭到強硬回應，接著壞事發生。不是那樣的。 我們談了這件事。順帶一提，昨晚我們整晚都在談這個問題。我現在對台灣的了解，可能比 對幾乎任何國家都還多。 福斯新聞主播拜爾： Do you think it dominated the talk? 你認為這個議題主導了整場談話嗎？ 美國總統川普： It has always been his most important thing from the day I knew him years ago. I have known him now 11 years, 12 years. It's always been the biggest thing for h im, Taiwan. Now, with me, I don't think they will do anything when I'm here. Whe n I'm not here, I think they might, to be honest with you. I'm not sure that the y would do anything if remained as is. But, they have somebody there now that wa nts to go independent. Well,that's a risky thing, when you go independent, you k now, they are going independent because they want to get into a war and they fig ured they have the United States behind them. I would like to see it stay the wa y it is. 從我多年前認識他（習）的那一天起，這一直都是他最重視的事情。我認識他已經11年、12 年。對他而言，台灣一直都是最重要的問題。 至於我，我不認為只要我還當總統，他們會做什麼；但等我不是總統，老實說，我認為他們 可能會。我不確定如果維持現狀，他們是否會採取行動。 但現在那裡有人想推動獨立。這是很危險的事。你知道，他們想推動獨立，就是因為想打一 場仗，認為背後有美國支持。我希望維持現狀。 美國總統川普： I will tell you something. I will make a little news. I would like to see everyb ody making chips in Taiwan come into America. To be honest with you I think it's the greatest thing can you do. It's a heated situation. There is no question ab out it. As you know, we have massive amounts of chip companies now from Taiwan a lready coming in. We expect to have 40% to 50% of the world chip business by the end of my term. And I think it should be even more than that. I think all of th ose chip companies, if they're smart, they are going to start heading to Arizona and to places where they're building. That is going to solve your problem. 我跟你說件事。我來講點新聞。我希望所有在台灣生產晶片的公司都到美國來。老實說，我 認為這是你能做的最好的事。這是一個高度緊張的局勢，毫無疑問。 你也知道，我們現在已經有大量來自台灣的晶片公司進駐美國。我們預計在我任期結束前， 掌握全球40％到50％的晶片產業。我認為甚至應該更多。 我認為那些晶片公司如果夠聰明，就會開始前往亞利桑那州，以及那些正在建廠的地方。那 將會解決你的問題。 福斯新聞主播拜爾： Should the people of Taiwan feel more or less secure after your meetings with Pr esident Xi? 在你與習近平會談後，台灣人民應該感到更安全，還是更不安全？ 美國總統川普： Neutral.中立 福斯新聞主播拜爾： Has the policy changed at all? 政策有任何改變嗎？ 美國總統川普： No, not nothing has changed. 沒有，什麼都沒變。 福斯新聞主播拜爾： U.S. policy? 美國政策呢？ 美國總統川普： nothing has changed. I will say this. I'm not looking to have somebody go indepe ndent and we're supposed to travel 9,500 miles to fight a war. I'm not looking f or that. I want them to cool down. I want China to cool down. 什麼都沒變。我可以這麼說：我不希望有人走向獨立，而且我們等於跋涉9500英里去打一場 戰爭。我不希望發生那種事。 我希望他們冷靜下來。我希望中國冷靜下來。 福斯新聞主播拜爾： You are weighing on approving billions of dollars of weapons for Taiwan. Is that moving forward? 你正在考慮是否批准對台數十億美元軍售。這件事會繼續推進嗎？ 美國總統川普： I haven't approved it yet. We're going to see what happens. 我還沒批准。我們要看看接下來會發生什麼事。 福斯新聞主播拜爾： What are you looking for? 你在看什麼？ 美國總統川普： I may do it. I may not do it. 我可能會批准，也可能不會批准。 福斯新聞主播拜爾： What is your hinge point? 你的關鍵考量點是什麼？ 美國總統川普： I'm not going to say that. I may or may not do it. We are not looking for wars. If you kept it the way it is, I think China is going to be okay with that. We ar e not looking to have somebody say let's go independent because the United State s is backing us. 這個我不會說。我可能會批准，也可能不會批准。我們不想看到戰爭。如果維持現狀，我認 為中國會接受。我們不希望有人說：「讓我們獨立吧，因為美國挺我們。」 福斯新聞主播拜爾： So President Xi probably liked that you haven't approved the weapons to Taiwan? 所以習主席大概很喜歡你還沒批准對台軍售這件事？ 美國總統川普： I would say like is maybe too strong a word because he thinks I could do it with just the signing of my signature, unlike Biden who couldn't sign his signature. No, I'm holding that in abeyance. It depends on China. It is a very good negotia ting chip for us, frankly. It's a lot of weapons. It's $12 billion. It's a lot o f weapons. But, you know, when you look at the odds, China is very, very powerfu l, big country. That's a very small island. Think of it, it's 59 miles away. 59 miles. We're 9500 miles away. That's a little bit of a difficult problem. 我認為「喜歡」這個詞可能有點太強烈，因為他覺得我只要簽個名就能做這件事，不像拜登 ，連自己的名字都簽不好。 不，我現在是暫時擱置這件事。這取決於中國。坦白說，這對我們而言是一張非常好的談判 籌碼。那是很多武器，價值120億美元，很多武器。 但你知道，當你看雙方實力，中國非常非常強大，是個大國，而那只是一個很小的島。想想 看，距離只有59英里。59英里。我們卻在9500英里之外。這是個有點棘手的問題。 With all of that being said, you know, if you look at the history of Taiwan, Tai wan was developed because we had presidents that didn't know what the hell they were doing. Because, if they would have put tariffs on chips coming in, they wou ld have never left. Everything was about Intel, and everything was about our chi p companies. They stole our chip industry. I have said that for years, for years . They stole our chips. If we have would have had just one of our presidents we are going to put 100 percent chips. You can leave and build in Taiwan. You sell it back into the United States, we're going to put 100 percent or 200 percent ta riff. We would have never lost a chismt we lost the chip industry. It's all comi ng back. 話雖如此，如果你看看台灣的歷史，台灣之所以能發展起來，是因為我們以前有些總統根本 不知道自己在幹嘛。因為如果他們當年對進口晶片課稅，這些產業根本不會離開。 以前一切都跟英特爾有關，一切都跟我們的晶片公司有關。他們偷走我們的晶片產業。我這 樣講很多年了，很多年了。他們偷走我們的晶片。 如果我們當時有任何一位總統說：「我們要對晶片課100％關稅。你可以去台灣設廠，但你 賣回美國時，我們會課100％甚至200％關稅。」我們根本不會失去晶片產業。 我們失去晶片產業，但現在一切都在回流。 美國總統川普： I do say this Taiwan would be very smart to cool it a little bit. China would be very smart to cool it a little bit. They ought to both cool it. 我要這麼說：台灣稍微冷靜一點會很明智，中國稍微冷靜一點也會很明智。雙方都應該冷靜 一點。 注意事項：請注意版規內容。 = = 這篇專訪討論度很高，各種不同陣營都試圖從中擷取隻言片語來做對自己有利的解釋。 不過看完全文，實在很難看出川普對臺灣有一絲的友善，如稱呼「這個地方」、偷走晶片的 陳腔濫調，尤其是這段「但現在那裡有人想推動獨立。這是很危險的事。你知道，他們想推 動獨立，就是因為想打一場仗，認為背後有美國支持。我希望維持現狀。」 上次美國講這麼直白，應該是蔡英文第一任時美國公開反對臺獨公投了（忘了那時是AIT出 來講還是國務院） --

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