和好=成神嗎？請教神學家！ 神學家東拉西扯的神功相信大家都非常的憎惡。這次，他為了標榜自己的神功蓋世，竟然 把愛任紐拖出來做他的擦屁股紙，這種侮辱先人的行為太過分了。所以，要修理修理他。 他這次用了一種很詭異的邏輯，就是：和好和神化都是屬於同歸於一；所以和好就是同歸 於一，而神化也是同歸於一（recapitulation）；所以和好（reconciliation）就是神化 （deification）。對於看不太懂我在說什麼的，我這樣解釋：這就好像說，因為神學家 的頭和屁股都是神學家的，所以神學家的頭就是神學家的屁股。以下是神學家的相關語錄 ： ※ 文章網址: https://webptt.com/m.aspx?n=bbs/Christianity/M.1465358851.A.FFC.html → theologe: 法理當然是稱義，正教神學不是偏生機我輸你 06/08 15:38 → theologe: 復和就是神化觀啦 06/08 15:38 ※ 文章網址: https://webptt.com/m.aspx?n=bbs/Christianity/M.1465399663.A.6A0.html → theologe: 嗯嗯 我是照貼的，或許他這點有錯誤吧，不過不影響復和 06/09 00:20 → theologe: 與同歸於一論的關係。 06/09 00:2 神學家扛出【愛任紐】畢竟令我蠻驚訝的。因為目前中文，只有基督教文藝出版社的一部 “不完全”的翻譯。若要真的瞭解愛任紐的神學，必須閱讀Pillip Schaff《古教父全集 》的anf01。區區正好曾經把anf01中愛任紐的《反異端》的第三到第五卷，一字不漏的拜 讀過一次。因為您既然如此熟悉愛任紐的神學，肯定是拜讀過anf01的高手；華人基督教 有此功力的人，只能用鳳毛麟抓形容之。所以，在此，小弟用三段話向神學家請教他自己 的論點。 為了完整表達愛任紐的神學，我引用的部分會比較長，免得產生“斷章取義”的錯誤。 1. Concurring with these statements, Paul, speaking to the Romans, declares: “Mu ch more they who receive abundance of grace and righteousness for [eternal] li fe, shall reign by one, Christ Jesus.”3607 It follows from this, that he knew nothing of that Christ who flew away from Jesus; nor did he of the Saviour ab ove, whom they hold to be impassible. For if, in truth, the one suffered, and the other remained incapable of suffering, and the one was born, but the other descended upon him who was born, and left him again, it is not one, but two, that are shown forth. But that the apostle did know Him as one, both who was b orn and who suffered, namely Christ Jesus, he again says in the same Epistle: “Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized in Christ Jesus were baptiz ed in His death? that like as Christ rose from the dead, so should we also wal k in newness of life.”3608 But again, showing that Christ did suffer, and was Himself the Son of God, who died for us, and redeemed us with His blood at th e time appointed beforehand, he says: “For how is it, that Christ, when we we re yet without strength, in due time died for the ungodly? But God commendeth His love towards us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. M uch more, then, being now justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. For if, when we were enemies, we were 【reconciled】 to God by t he death of His Son; much more, being 【reconciled】, we shall be saved by His life.”3609 He declares in the plainest manner, that the same Being who was l aid hold of, and underwent suffering, and shed His blood for us, was both Chri st and the Son of God, who did also rise again, and was taken up into heaven, as he himself [Paul] says: “But at the same time, [it, is] Christ [that] died , yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God.”3610 And again, “Knowing that Christ, rising from the dead, dieth no more:”3611 for, as himself foreseeing, through the Spirit, the subdivisions of evil teach ers [with regard to the Lord’s person], and being desirous of cutting away fr om them all occasion of cavil, he says what has been already stated, [and also declares:] “But if the Spirit of Him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwel l in you, He that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your morta l bodies.”3612 This he does not utter to those alone who wish to hear: Do not err, [he says to all:] Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is one and the same, who did by suffering reconcile us to God, and rose from the dead; who is at the r ight hand of the Father, and perfect in all things; “who, when He was buffete d, struck not in return; who, when He suffered, threatened not;”3613 and when He underwent tyranny, He prayed His Father that He would forgive those who ha d crucified Him. For He did Himself truly bring in salvation: since He is Hims elf the Word of God, Himself the Only-begotten of the Father, Christ Jesus our Lord. (PG 639-640) ２． But now the case stands thus, that the Word has saved that which really was [c reated, viz.,] humanity which had perished, effecting by means of Himself that communion which should be held with it, and seeking out its salvation. But th e thing which had perished possessed flesh and blood. For the Lord, taking dus t from the earth, moulded man; and it was upon his behalf that all the dispens ation of the Lord’s advent took place. He had Himself, therefore, flesh and b lood, recapitulating in Himself not a certain other, but that original handiwo rk of the Father, seeking out that thing which had perished. And for this caus e the apostle, in the Epistle to the Colossians, says, “And though ye were fo rmerly alienated, and enemies to His knowledge by evil works, yet now ye have been 【reconciled】 in the body of His flesh, through His death, to present yo urselves holy and chaste, and without fault in His sight.”4567 He says, “Ye have been 【reconciled】 in the body of His flesh,” because the righteous fle sh has reconciled that lesh which was being kept under bondage in sin, and br ought it into friendship with God. （pg786） 3. If, then, any one allege that in this respect the flesh of the Lord was differ ent from ours, because it indeed did not commit sin, neither was deceit found in His soul, while we, on the other hand, are sinners, he says what is the fac t. But if he pretends that the, Lord possessed another substance of flesh, the sayings respecting reconciliation will not agree with that man. For that thin g is reconciled which had formerly been in enmity. Now, if the Lord had taken flesh from another substance, He would not, by so doing, have reconciled that one to God which had become inimical through transgression. But now, by means of communion with Himself, the Lord has reconciled man to God the Father, in r econciling us to Himself by the body of His own flesh, and redeeming us by His own blood, as the apostle says to the Ephesians, “In whom we have redemption through His blood, the remission of sins;”4568 and again to the same he says , “Ye who formerly were far off have been brought near in the blood of Christ ;”4569 and again, “Abolishing in His flesh the enmities, [even] the law of c ommandments [contained] in ordinances.”4570 And in every Epistle the apostle plainly testifies, that through the flesh of our Lord, and through His blood, we have been saved. （pg787） 在此，我想請教神學家三個問題： 1- 上面三段的內容是什麼？ 2- 上面三段對於【和好（reconciliation）】的定義是什麼？ 3- 上面三段有沒有說【和好=神化】？ --

※ 發信站: 批踢踢實業坊(ptt.cc), 來自: 180.217.151.70 ※ 文章網址: https://webptt.com/m.aspx?n=bbs/Christianity/M.1465446130.A.D9A.html 老魚說，春天恐怕還不知道，聖經不是天上掉下來的。新約聖經正典第一次被肯定是亞他 那修的復活節文告。最終確定是425年的迦太基會議。鄉憨至此，令人莞爾。本人宣佈， 此君（或此妹）絕對不是地方召會的，他（她）的行為當自己負責。 ※ 編輯: outra (180.217.151.70), 06/09/2016 13:27:03 不僅臉被打的像豬頭,連腦子都是豬腦!老夫早就料到你會用這個賤招,早引用了.充鐵一次,你自己去找[] ２． But now the case stands thus, that the Word has saved that which really was [c reated, viz.,] humanity which had perished, effecting by means of Himself that communion which should be held with it, and seeking out its salvation. But th e thing which had perished possessed flesh and blood. For the Lord, taking dus t from the earth, moulded man; and it was upon his behalf that all the dispens ation of the Lord’s advent took place. He had Himself, therefore, flesh and b lood, recapitulating in Himself not a certain other, but that original handiwo rk of the Father, seeking out that thing which had perished. And for this caus e the apostle, in the Epistle to the Colossians, says, “And though ye were fo rmerly alienated, and enemies to His knowledge by evil works, yet now ye have been 【reconciled】 in the body of His flesh, through His death, to present yo urselves holy and chaste, and without fault in His sight.”4567 He says, “Ye have been 【reconciled】 in the body of His flesh,” because the righteous fle sh has reconciled that lesh which was being kept under bondage in sin, and br ought it into friendship with God. （pg786） ※ 編輯: outra (180.217.151.70), 06/09/2016 22:25:59