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Emma写了一封信给大家,请我帮忙代po 本人持中立立场,把Emma写的信放在板上,未做任何更动 我是谁不重要,因内容有图片,所以我把图片放在我的FB相簿(我不会做网页) 我并不想红,麻烦大家了!! Dear lovely Taiwanese students at NTU. I am in a very sad and frustrated position right now. I have just finished five AMAZING months and NTU and during my stay in Taiwan I have met a lot of wonderful, amazing people. I always told my friends in Denmark that Taiwan has some of the nicest people in the world. And it is true! I have come to love your amazing country a LOT! In the beginning of September I moved into the Chang Shing dorm at NTU since I wanted to live close to the other exchange students and have a social life. I am a very sociable person and I have previously lived in Australia, France, London and Saudi-Arabia where I have shared apartments and rooms with all sorts of people. When I lived in Australia I even shared an apartment with Chinese people. And they are still some of my lovely friends today. The first day that I moved into the dorm I wanted to call my father to tell him that I had arrived safely and that I was doing well. I called my father around 3pm in the afternoon in my room in the dorm. Two minutes into the conversation I hear a knocking on my door. I tell my father to ‘hold on’ so that I could open. When I open the door I see my new neighbor asking me to “lower my voice so that she could practice her French”. I told her that it was very hard for me to lower my voice as it was just a normal speaking voice. Anyways, I still did and accepted her complaint. Ever since this day, every time I would Skype, dry my hair, listen to music (I would NEVER listen to techno and never after 10pm or before 8am), she would complain. I am just a normal girl trying to live my life and I did ONLY normal things. I have also been travelling a lot during my stay in Taiwan so I was hardly in my room at all. But whenever I was, I always felt absolutely horrible. I knew that if my phone rang, I could not pick it up because that would mean that I would have a ‘knocking’ on my wall. Even if my new friends called me to ask if I wanted to come down for dinner I was afraid of picking up my phone. Therefore I wrote my neighbor a letter in September, telling her that I think that I hoped she would appreciate the fact that I have to make phone calls and that because of the time difference I would sometimes have to call at 7-8pm etc. This letter can be found below: http://0rz.tw/ir5Oo She has read the letter but she gave me back the earplugs that I had bought for her. Throughout my semester in Taipei, I have been away almost every other weekend either travelling around Taiwan or to other Asian countries. But I always hated coming back to the dorm as I knew that I could never feel relaxed in my room. Therefore, I wanted to ask some of the other exchange students if they had similar problems and I sent them this email: Me: 19 September 2010 at 11:53 GIRLS!!! I have to ask you if you know what the rules are regarding talking in your own room... It can't be true that my neighbour has to knock on my door every time I skype with someone. It's not like it's loud at all. It's just a normal conversation... I can't imagine it is illegal to speak in your own room??? Have you had any problems with your neighbours, or am I just super unlucky regarding my lucky pick next-door ;o) ???? I wanna find out if she's actually allowed to tell me not to speak (isn't that a human right) ;o))) ??? But I wanna ask you before I ask in the reception. No need to create a drama. She just ANNOYS me ;) See ya later for a late dinner ??? xoxo Michelle Heaton: 19 September 2010 at 11:58 Reply‧ Report Hahaha, I think that u just are super unlucky. I skype all the time and play music and everything and no one has told me anything! Of course u should be allowed to talk in the phone or skype in your own room! I am definitely up for a later dinner, maybe at 19.30? Sofia Hansson: 19 September 2010 at 12:06 Reply‧ Report hahaha OMG, i just met my neighbour, she is actually the birthday girl that's why i haven't had any complains... Im also playing the music all the time or wathever... I guesse there should be a rule or something that allows u to make noises untill 10pm and then to be quiet, u should ask downstairs, but she seeems so annoying! Or we should find her a boyfriend so that she can actually get out of that room and get a life... hahaha (ok that was me just being mean! sorry! Yeah sure lets meet for dinner, but not to early if thats okay because im suppose to skype... so 7.30 or 8pm seems perfect! Me: 19 September 2010 at 12:12 Pheeeeeeeeeew. Thank God. It seems like I'm not super crazy. I feel like I'm doing something wrong every time I skype etc. She has never complained when I listen to music but every time I speak she knocks on my door and asks me to lower the volume - and it isn't loud at all!!!! I feel like a prisoner and I feel guilty every time I skype and I don't like nor want that!!! So thank you girls for saying that you are doing the same. I have the impression that she is just studying (her French apparently) ALL the time. She's one of those 5am - 11pm student. Maybe I should ask Steven to pretend he works here and tell her that it is allowed to speak in your own room (what a great plan that is)! :D And of course after 10pm, noise it is a different story ;o) 8PM for dinner = perfect!!! See ya downstairs ladies ♥ Cher Lloyd: 19 September 2010 at 13:26 Reply‧ Report so sorry, I'm late. I do not have any problem with my neighbours, even if I 'm always making noise. Indeed, I can hear one of them singing sometimes. It is quite fun. So sorry, but I think you are really unlucky. Good luck. See at 8 pm These mails clearly show that I was just having a very unlucky pick of neighbor. I always told the reception about this also as well as the management of the dorm. However, their reaction was always: “yes, she is very sensitive”. Nothing else ever happened. And I have been informed that last year, another poor girl living next to my neighbor was the one being bullied by my neighbor constantly knocking on her door asking stuff like ‘where does this water sound came from’ as she wanted to know who was taking a shower. This shows that my neighbor, indeed, is very sensitive. But that does NOT give her the right to knock on walls late at night and disturb other people. Throughout the last two months of my stay I started to hear her scream in her room. Even when I was super quiet in my own room. I do not know why she would scream, but it did sound like something was wrong in there. I also informed the reception about these screams and knocking, and all I received was smiles and a nod. One Sunday afternoon I was skyping with my old grandmother for maybe 20 minutes. Throughout this whole conversation my neighbor was CONSTANTLY knocking on my wall so much that I could not concentrate on what my poor, old grandmother was saying. I also informed the reception once again and the management and the response were none-existing. I did not lower my voice when I spoke to my grandmother as she has a bad hearing and because I was only talking with a normal speaking voice. As revenge my neighbor woke me up at 4am that same night by knocking on her wall right next to my bed. I usually do not wake up easily but this night I did, as it was a CLEAR attempt to wake me up. She knocked for maybe 15-20 seconds. This left me awake for 2 hours as my heart was beating SO fast and I was so angry and frustrated. Once again I told the reception. Every time I had some of these incidents and knocking on walls I would ALWAYS tell the other exchange students. They have all been following my story throughout the whole stay. They all thought that it sounded crazy and wondered why nothing happened from the management’s side. So everyone was aware of all of this. Unfortunately, my Chinese is VERY poor so I could not post about my thoughts and frustrations on the PPT page. I could only do Facebook and tell my friends in Taiwan about it. The 19th of September I sent this message to Steven who is an amazing guy and friend to all of us: http://0rz.tw/tjCeD Then on Friday the 14th of January 2011, I had been out shopping with my friend to buy presents for the exchange coordinators as we think they have done an amazing job for all of us exchange students throughout our stay. I came back to the dorm around 3pm and I opened my door as QUIETLY as possible because I knew that if I my neighbor would hear me come home, she would knock, AGAIN! S o I entered slowly and I was sitting on my bed on my computer not making ANY noise at all. No Skype and no music. Still, I hear my neighbor knock a couple of times even though, she did not know if I was in my room, or not. But all of a sudden I see her face looking through my window. So my neighbor had jumped out her window to look through MY window and invading MY privacy to see if I was in my room so that she could start knocking. I yelled at her and told her to “GO AWAY!” At this point I was VERY upset, SAD and frustrated. I went straight to my friend’s room and asked her if I could please sleep in her room, as I could not live in my room anymore. Also, I told the reception about it and their response was: “I am very sorry to hear about this!” That same night on Friday the 14th of January, some of us exchange students were having a couple of beers in the common room since it was the last night for some people. We are talking about my neighbor and my friends are so annoyed about it all as well. I went up to my room to pick up my jacket which only took two minutes. AGAIN, she knocked on my wall and I went down to tell the others. So we agreed on that we should go to my neighbor’s room and knock on her door and window and ask her why she would do this kind of stuff to people. So six of us entered the female dorm around midnight and went to room 905. Our aim was NEVER to threaten anyone; it was never to hurt anyone, or the like. We simply wanted to ask her why she did what she did. Since the dorm did not do anything, we thought we should all talk to her. So we entered my room and one of my friends jump out the window and knocks slowly on her window saying “Excuse me, can you please open the window. We want to talk to you,” nothing else. She of course does not open. Furthermore, another guy knocks on her door and tells her to stop harassing others in the middle of the night and that she needs to treat others the way she wants to be treated. He said: “Hey there, open the door!! Do you really think that it is funny to knock on others wall every day and night? If you want to study in total silence, please go to the library, people have right to live their own life in normal day time! She is going to leave in a few days, Why dont you just let her go????!!!!" We even have pictures of the knocking on the window which CLEARLY shows that is it NOTHING compared to the reconstruction that was on TV Saturday the 15th of January. I have attached the picture of the knocking beneath. Please notice how the hand is knocking silently with just one finger. http://0rz.tw/MEJ1E http://0rz.tw/RwN5D There were NEVER ANY death threats at this night. No one mentioned the word ‘death’ and no one wanted to hurt anyone. All the exchange students are some of the nicest and most lovely people you will ever meet and none of us would ever hurt a mouse. We are all very normal people who see the best in everything. We simply wanted to ask my neighbor WHY she was constantly annoying other people around her since we do NOT think that this is okay! YES, it was WRONG to walk into the dorm at night. But in our countries we do not separate male and female and we probably did not think of it to be as wrong as the local people do. To us, it is just a dorm. We totally understand and respect the local rules and we apologize for breaking this rule about boys entering the dorm after 11pm. When we walked past the reception we just said that we would be back in 2mins. We did not make any other excuses saying that we had to pack and carry stuff, or the like. We simply said: “we will be back in 2mins!” and entered the dorm. After this we left the dorm and some people went to bed and some went out. The next day we wake up hearing that someone has created an untrue story on a local forum. Since none of us speak Chinese, we do not have the possibility of interacting and tell our side of the story. So instead we all of a sudden receive HORRIBLE messages on Facebook, phone calls and the like. Some of these messages are very childish and it was clear to us that the local students of NTU did not know the real truth at all. We were all very sad that judgments had been taken without hearing the story from the other side. Remember! There are ALWAYS two sides of every story. Whether it is a couple that breaks up or it is a person that gets fired from work. ALWAYS talk to both sides before making a judgment! At this point we are all having a meeting with the management at the school and we inform them about our version of the story. They understand our situation and frustration and listen to us. Still they say that it is hard for them to stop the false allegations on the local PPT. We are all very sad that we cannot tell our side of the story and instead we have to wait for the school to do something. At night we hear that 200 people turn up at the dorm to demonstrate and still none of these people know the real truth. Now we have given an interview to a newspaper and we all hope that the lovely students at NTU will understand that this is a very sad situation for us all. We came to Taiwan to learn about your wonderful country, smiles and people. And we have had an AMAZING time. Taiwan really is fantastic! I also want to add that Steven Chiu is one of the friendliest guys you will ever meet. He has done so much for us all and he is the one who helped us when we could not find our way home, wanted to go to Carrefour or other things. Steven has not done anything wrong at all and he only deserves good things in life. Steven has introduced us all to your lovely country and he has done A LOT to inform us about everything that we need to know about Taiwan. He has been our link to a lot of things. Everything that he has done is simply amazing!!! We are just sad that we had to leave like this and we hope that you all have read our story and will believe that we are all good people who would never hurt or harm anyone. If I had not lived in my room, it would have been someone else. I was just unlucky and any of you would have gone crazy with a constant knocking on the wall every time you dry your hair, call your parents or listen to your favorite music in the afternoon for a couple of hours at a low level. These are things that should be legal and essential in any dorm room. Of course people should respect each other, but as I sad earlier, I have always lived with other people in very different countries, and I never had any problems with anyone, EVER! They are all still my friends today! Thank you for your understanding and please create peace. The world is so beautiful and we need to make it more beautiful! Keep smiling and thank you for reading!!! I love Taiwan!!! Ps: Finally, I want to add that I am a very normal girl who loves all my friends and family. I have visited Asia MANY times and I am in love. Furthermore, I have a LOT of friends all over the world from England, to the US, to Malaysia, and now Taiwan. I am positive, open-minded and very easy to talk to and I see the best in everybody. My home country, Denmark, is one of the safest and nicest places in the world. Last year we were nominated ‘The Happiest Nation in the World’. We are all very open-minded and for the Danes, Taiwan and Asia is very interesting. We are big fans of your culture here in Taiwan. Danish people are as quiet, peaceful and sweet as the Taiwanese! --



※ 发信站: 批踢踢实业坊(ptt.cc)
◆ From: 140.112.234.192
1F:推 zxiop:投推 01/17 23:44
2F:→ Murasaki0110:惨 这大概要寒假完才看得完 01/17 23:45
3F:嘘 dormg:Emma好像是管院硕士专班的,都成年了,信中还不自知问题重点? 01/17 23:47
4F:→ yuhung:GRE阅读都没那麽长... 01/17 23:47
5F:→ ajtptw:po到八卦版马上就有各式各样的翻译文了 01/17 23:47
6F:→ newsboy3423:哀 ............. 01/17 23:48
7F:→ dormg:她以为她住水泥隔间吗?在木板隔间的环境中,噪音"标准"比较严 01/17 23:49
8F:→ dormg:她的脑袋瓜理解不了吗?其他玩喀不在意噪音,可被她拿来振振有 01/17 23:50
9F:→ HuckleberryF:BBS的20页英文,看来这事情的发展真的让她有焦虑到 01/17 23:50
10F:嘘 Eroticism:重点在她还是有烙男人深夜去女舍骚扰女学生 01/17 23:51
11F:→ dormg:词认为自己"不算"制造噪音吗?全信让大家见证了何谓东拉西扯~ 01/17 23:51
12F:→ ajtptw:会怕就好 01/17 23:51
13F:→ Eroticism:不管她和苦主之前的恩怨,她当晚的行为就是乱来 01/17 23:51
14F:→ newsboy3423:真的是 顾左右而言他 01/17 23:51
15F:→ newsboy3423:话说 不要嘘原PO拉 = = 01/17 23:52
16F:嘘 insachi:避重就轻,说法也跟政人所述不符,还想用人情攻势 01/17 23:52
17F:→ dormg:各位在外租那种木板隔间又要准备考试的屋,你放音乐试试看!社 01/17 23:52
18F:→ zounds:完了~八卦板又要翻译之乱了= = 01/17 23:52
19F:推 jansia:快推回来... 不然原PO没事做多一篇劣文 亏很大 01/17 23:52
20F:→ dormg:会上没在跟你客气的~ps.你租到全是玩喀学生或上班族不念书的 01/17 23:52
21F:→ newsboy3423:需多了不会劣啦 01/17 23:53
22F:推 KevHuang508:管他前面理由写得落落长,那都不是重点= =" 重点是有 01/17 23:53
23F:嘘 jacky1990b:END 01/17 23:53
24F:→ zounds:先备份 01/17 23:53
25F:嘘 dodo1018:讲中文吼 01/17 23:53
26F:→ KevHuang508:人违反规定进入宿舍,并且使人心生恐惧吧= = 01/17 23:53
27F:→ dormg:木板隔间case则是例外,否则有基本智商的人都知要共体时艰:静 01/17 23:54
28F:推 impactwhite:帮原PO补血 01/17 23:54
29F:→ BowLongSing:完了完了 这篇出来 又一堆人要翻译了 01/17 23:55
30F:推 dOodoOhOw:太长了不想翻... 01/17 23:56
31F:→ yukuan1026:帮补血 01/17 23:56
32F:嘘 northfire:开始人情攻势了吗 01/17 23:56
33F:推 newsboy3423:都有证人了 还狡辩 01/17 23:56
34F:推 a3225737:谁要转八卦 就有人翻译了 01/17 23:57
35F:推 kyo89412:虽然她写得不错.. 不过有些事是事实... 帮推 01/17 23:57
36F:→ a3225737:不过说实在的他都没用什麽深难词字连我都看得懂.. 01/17 23:57
37F:推 heuristik:非常多的现场详细对话细节 还蛮像是捏造的...(个人感觉) 01/17 23:58
38F:推 tompy:他自认为总是很安静 跟正常人一样 他别的邻居可不是这麽说的 01/17 23:58
39F:→ HuckleberryF:我只看了前几段加最後两段,中间看到她举了一些也是 01/17 23:58
40F:→ tompy:不过我想他应该是真的认为自己很安静 这种事很主观的 01/17 23:59
41F:→ HuckleberryF:外籍交换学生的留言,来举证她这些行为很多人做 01/17 23:59
42F:→ tompy:而且他的朋友当然赞同他 一点说服力都没有 01/18 00:00
43F:→ HuckleberryF:但没有受到他人的抱怨 (大概都是台湾人不敢或不计较) 01/18 00:00
44F:→ Lxr:居然没人转数字板? 不过也好 我不想再看到Emma之乱 = = 01/18 00:00
45F:推 zounds:=================google 翻译很好用===================== 01/18 00:00
46F:推 john668:太长了我END= = 晚点再看... 01/18 00:00
47F:推 ningningning:一直强调自己去过很多地方跟很多人相处都没问题 01/18 00:01
48F:→ ningningning:so what? 这样就真的没问题喔?!! 01/18 00:01
49F:嘘 isaacc:这封信真是证明自己她们疑似犯罪阿~伤脑筋 01/18 00:01
50F:→ fakeayumi:她举证那些信只让我觉得台湾人好NICE好会忍 01/18 00:02
51F:→ cestor:就算她说得是真的 同时让两个男生在阳台和门口"找人" 还是 01/18 00:02
52F:→ insachi:台湾人真的比较不跟人计较,我在英国听得多是宁愿隐忍也不 01/18 00:02
53F:→ Lxr:我错了有人转了 = = 01/18 00:02
54F:→ insachi:跟恶邻居吵的台湾人 01/18 00:02
55F:→ closmaloud:行得正的话为何说词反反覆覆? 01/18 00:02
56F:→ cestor:还是非常吓人吧? 01/18 00:02
57F:→ newsboy3423:都没人抱怨 不代表你这样做是对的 丝毫没有反省 01/18 00:02
58F:推 lin214:他说他们那一夥人都不会英文所以不能上"PPT"讲话 01/18 00:02
59F:→ lin214:那小天使是哪里人 01/18 00:03
60F:推 oralsex5566:我没转 01/18 00:03
61F:嘘 dabengo:他写这些东西,好好笑耶 他头脑应该没问题吧 01/18 00:03
62F:推 bluegold:借转 01/18 00:03
bluegold:转录至看板 Gossiping 01/18 00:04 LoveBushido:转录至看板 Gossiping 01/18 00:04
63F:→ dabengo:这封信看起来像国中生在辩解 他说一堆废话到底想说什麽 01/18 00:04
64F:推 NotJill:先拍台湾人马屁...後面真的有够长.... 01/18 00:04
65F:→ shtmn:有写跟没写一样 无助於处理事情 01/18 00:05
66F:→ lin214:我是指中文 01/18 00:05
67F:推 dsmwang:看完了。先推肯出来解释自己的说法。 01/18 00:06
68F:→ dsmwang:有某一段有提到评断之前应要听两方说法,那段很中肯。 01/18 00:06
69F:推 yuhung:可以和Emma说是PTT不是PPT吗?XD 01/18 00:07
70F:→ dsmwang:关於之前相处状况,nqc最好也出来澄清有没有半夜敲他墙壁 01/18 00:07
71F:推 ortho:结论:太子建设的超烂隔音,挑起了两方噪音认知不同的死结 01/18 00:07
72F:→ dsmwang:Emma两篇文章都提到这件事,对她而言应是很重要的一件事 01/18 00:08
73F:推 rainlingring:半夜敲人墙壁真的会被敲到崩溃 01/18 00:08
74F:推 pinkwind:他不是说才一个男生 现在是马上附图打嘴巴? 01/18 00:08
75F:→ rainlingring:苦主似乎也选了错误的方法沟通? 01/18 00:08
76F:→ dabengo:真的很困惑,避重就轻是要怎样;写一大堆狗屁 01/18 00:08
77F:→ dsmwang:楼上,她是说爬过去的只有一个男孩...你误会了 01/18 00:08
78F:推 newsboy3423:但 爬阳台那件事呢? 01/18 00:09
79F:推 tompy:这封自白书图文并茂 连证据录影带都不用找了 他要投案吗? 01/18 00:09
80F:→ ortho:另外我非常想听nqc自己现身说明 你到底有没有平常因为噪音 01/18 00:09
81F:推 zounds:我觉得他那些朋友的邻居应该只是不想投诉他而已= = 01/18 00:09
82F:→ dsmwang:爬阳台也有提到,也是说只有一个人爬过去,也有附图 01/18 00:09
83F:→ ortho:儿也常常如同信中所说"神经质的拍她墙壁"? 01/18 00:09
84F:→ yuhung:为什麽烙人时他们还要拍照啊?是已经预知会有这些事情?XD 01/18 00:09
85F:推 herb4745:说真的...如果要嘘的人也说出有格调一点的话吧= =' 01/18 00:09
86F:推 blowfish:重点难道不是隔音太差吗... 01/18 00:10
87F:→ dsmwang:这篇有非常多信件往来和照片,不似伪造 01/18 00:10
88F:→ newsboy3423:话说 阳台照片..... 01/18 00:10
89F:→ qilar:但为啥苦主说有听到有人用流利的中文讲话@@ 01/18 00:11
90F:→ dsmwang:请不要急着否定她的说词,违规事实早就确定,不会更改 01/18 00:12
91F:→ yuhung:楼上...其中一个是台大的同学啊 当时一定讲中文不是? 01/18 00:12
92F:推 groffp2010:阿 讲中文的那不就是小天使吗= = 01/18 00:12
93F:推 yaopheasant:所以是一个长期被精神折磨的邻居突然性的反扑? 01/18 00:13
94F:推 herb4745:大推dsmwang 不要急着否定,建议苦主出来说明 01/18 00:13
95F:→ dsmwang:不能完全相信Emma,但也不能完全相信nqc。 01/18 00:13
96F:推 rehtra:有没有中文摘要啊? 01/18 00:13
97F:→ yaopheasant:若是真的只能说Emma的方式错了   她该折磨回去的XD 01/18 00:13
98F:→ dsmwang:双方说法出入的地方,可能就是问题爆发的症结。 01/18 00:14
99F:→ dsmwang:而且双方都非常抱怨管理员没有作用,这点也值得注意。 01/18 00:15
100F:推 newyvonne:. 01/18 00:15
101F:推 ppppooqqqq:其实跟之前那封内容差不多.这篇只是讲得比较罗嗦一点 01/18 00:15
102F:推 topinal:落人恐吓邻居这点拿出来 就自知理亏拉 01/18 00:15
103F:推 innovated:事件发生到这情况nqc大 是否能出来再进一步说明? 01/18 00:16
104F:推 capri75:看完了....原告nqc要不要出来对质 01/18 00:16
105F:推 newsboy3423:不过 这篇有图 01/18 00:16
106F:→ capri75:不然这篇打脸打很大 01/18 00:16
107F:→ ppppooqqqq:然後一直加上台湾人很好很好很好来化解敌意 01/18 00:16
108F:→ newsboy3423:还有 希望有更多邻近住户说明 01/18 00:16
109F:→ ortho:nqc踹共啦 事情等你厘清了!!!!!!!!!!!! 01/18 00:16
110F:推 tbmaker:不对质不知道结果 两边说法差的有点多 01/18 00:16
111F:→ GothicMetal:不变的点是长兴BOT的人员对任何一方都没有任何作为... 01/18 00:16
112F:→ dsmwang:这边呼吁nqc出来说明一下,这对事实厘清相当有帮助。 01/18 00:17
113F:推 rainlingring:我觉得邱学弟也可以出来说明一下 虽然好像很难.. 01/18 00:17
114F:→ capri75:柜台只会微笑跟点头 一点屁用都没有 01/18 00:17
115F:推 yaopheasant:我觉得不能光就当时事件来断定谁对谁错,即使他们真的 01/18 00:17
116F:→ capri75:然後说"你的室友很敏感" 是只会跳针的NPC嘛 01/18 00:18
117F:推 tim360403: JIZZ 01/18 00:18
118F:→ dsmwang:版上的人都骂成这样还想要学弟出来...我只能说不太可能 01/18 00:18
119F:→ yaopheasant:进行可怕的骚扰,但若在当下自己是受了如此长期折磨的 01/18 00:18
120F:→ ppppooqqqq:他朋友应该有帮他翻译ptt的重要观点.有打到要害 01/18 00:18
121F:推 Eeli2008:看十四页吧 事情发生经过的说法 01/18 00:18
122F:→ tim360403: 欧趴 01/18 00:18
123F:→ dsmwang:若之前版上用词平缓许多的话,我想当事人会更愿意出来吧。 01/18 00:18
124F:→ yaopheasant:当事人仍会觉得自己是情有可原的,就像被长期家暴的妇 01/18 00:18
125F:→ capri75:如果我是Emma 遇到这种邻居 也会抓狂 01/18 00:19
126F:→ sundream11:如果她说的是真那原告的行为不是让人受了更长时间的 01/18 00:19
127F:→ dsmwang:但是请注意最後的违规事实仍然存在,有原因不代表正确 01/18 00:19
128F:→ yaopheasant:人哪天突然暴发杀了自己的先生,在那个情境下也很难说 01/18 00:19
129F:推 jokerjoe:嗯?他就一直在强调隔壁很敏感和邱新皓是好人这件事啊 01/18 00:20
130F:→ yaopheasant:是谁对谁错,现在Emma站出来说明了,苦主是否也该出来 01/18 00:20
131F:→ jokerjoe:上次证人所说的邱新皓的叫嚣和恐怖撞击声都没提到?= = 01/18 00:20
132F:推 myhole:是""受害者"" 苦主是受害者家属....国小老师常常请假?? 01/18 00:20
133F:→ yaopheasant:回应? 毕竟前面邻居也提到苦主的确比较敏感,柜台也 01/18 00:21
134F:推 ortho:nqc踹共啦!!!!!!!!!!!(没恶意,只想知道真相) 01/18 00:21
135F:→ GothicMetal:nqc在宿舍版那三篇文章要不要先备份一下? 01/18 00:21
136F:→ BowLongSing:看完了 或许他们两人间有相处上的困难 01/18 00:21
137F:→ jokerjoe:邱新皓如果觉得自己没做事干嘛不出来= =?有emma帮你撑腰 01/18 00:21
138F:推 dabengo:他说他们受报纸访问了,为什麽不先对质呢?谁还要听单方面 01/18 00:21
139F:→ yaopheasant:说过苦主曾换过许多邻居,照目前看来搞不好Emma只是第 01/18 00:21
140F:→ jokerjoe:苦主跟EMMA两边我都看过了 最可恶的还是邱新皓 01/18 00:21
141F:推 rainlingring:照之前版上情况看 邱出来讲什麽都不会被信任吧... 01/18 00:22
142F:→ sundream11:恐惧吗? 01/18 00:22
143F:→ HuckleberryF:这不叫说明,这是自我辩解 无论宿舍里的相处如何 01/18 00:22
144F:→ HuckleberryF:搞到找人来踹共就是不对 01/18 00:22
145F:→ yaopheasant:一个没有被逼走反击回去的受害者?(以这篇为真的论点 01/18 00:22
146F:推 capri75:乡民绝招:未审先判 证人出来讲的不合意只会被嘘爆 科科 01/18 00:23
147F:推 hanachan:Emma说none of us speak Chinese,所以没办法上ptt解释 01/18 00:23
148F:推 jackeylaw:都是受BOT宿舍恶劣隔音品质所害 01/18 00:23
149F:→ HuckleberryF:邱的说法,一定是从Emma那听来的,但是他们要解释 01/18 00:23
150F:→ hanachan:难道邱先生也不会说中文吗~_~ 01/18 00:23
151F:推 jokerjoe:三更半夜找男人来敲门爬窗 说是打算要好好沟通谁相信啊? 01/18 00:23
152F:推 bobmuntoa:好孩子英文读本 01/18 00:24
153F:→ HuckleberryF:的是那晚他们这样的做为对吗? 01/18 00:24
154F:→ jokerjoe:各位女生会开门OR开窗吗= =? 01/18 00:24
155F:推 saigxx:国企小坏坏你在哪~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 01/18 00:24
156F:→ HuckleberryF:这篇文章前前後後都只是想替自己的行为开脱而已 01/18 00:25
157F:→ jokerjoe:还装好人帮邱新皓讲话= = 01/18 00:25
158F:→ sun0518:看完了 各方快出来对质厘清事实! 01/18 00:25
159F:→ bobmuntoa:emma这件互有对错的事好好处里说不定能解决很多事情 01/18 00:25
160F:→ jokerjoe:之前证人说的话当我们都不记得喔= =? 01/18 00:25
161F:推 oxkay:如果他真的只是要沟通,怎会挑要回国的前两天? 01/18 00:26
162F:→ bobmuntoa:学校太子交换生议题一次满足 01/18 00:26
163F:推 hanachan:而且这群人也太妙了,爬到别人窗户前敲窗户还拍照留念? 01/18 00:26
164F:嘘 aal:要放FB却连分享相簿都不会吗? 01/18 00:26
165F:推 yaopheasant:H大大概就是在法庭上坚持 法绝对大於情理的人吧? 01/18 00:26
166F:→ akilo:nqc的文章也是前前後後都想把EMMA定罪啊 有差吗 ̄▽ ̄ 01/18 00:26
167F:→ jokerjoe:如果真的只是要沟通为什麽要半夜爬窗+邱新皓中文叫嚣? 01/18 00:26
168F:推 newsboy3423:从另一个角度想 爱马 nqc 都是隔音问题的受害者 01/18 00:27
169F:推 fakeayumi:可是,对一个女生来说,前门有人敲门,窗户有男人敲窗, 01/18 00:27
170F:→ jokerjoe:怕nqc听不懂还找邱新皓来用流利中文叫嚣?^^好贴心喔 01/18 00:27
171F:→ ortho:nqc踹共就能让事情尽快解决了 透过转述也好 快踹共 01/18 00:27
172F:推 yoorange:H大可能觉得邓如雯应该死刑吧~喔不,上面一堆都是。 01/18 00:27
173F:→ fakeayumi:真得是很可怕的事... 01/18 00:27
174F:推 HuckleberryF:所以yao您是觉得犯错的行为,还要帮他找理由开脱吗? 01/18 00:27
175F:→ ortho:太子隔音超烂 间接导致一切问题的发生 超没商业道德 01/18 00:28
176F:推 yuhung:说真的 我觉得这两天在NTU板最大的收获就是练英文阅读 01/18 00:28
177F:推 cc88c8c8:弹壳头盖骨理论 01/18 00:28
178F:推 yl8376515:我居然看完了 01/18 00:28
179F:推 jazzlamb:现在没人说Emma当晚的事情是对的啊...既然违规错就是错, 01/18 00:28
180F:→ HuckleberryF:把谈背後的原因,那是事情解决後,当下就是当下 01/18 00:28
181F:→ jazzlamb:但并不是事情这样就结束了吧,我们不真正了解实际的情况 01/18 00:28
182F:→ yuhung:虽然内文很简单 却是很生活化的题材 比读黄宝绿宝还有趣 01/18 00:28
183F:→ jazzlamb:怎麽知道Emma是出於可被理解的动机还是单纯蓄意攻击? 01/18 00:28
184F:→ jazzlamb:怎麽会知道宿舍管理问题是出在哪个环节? 01/18 00:28
185F:推 renlin:是说现在也有同学交换去他们学校吧 希望不会被影响到 01/18 00:29
186F:→ jokerjoe:邱新皓您现在有EMMA来帮您漂白 下学期就要靠自己罗^^ 01/18 00:29
187F:→ fakeayumi:话说柯南不是每次犯人被揪出来也会讲一些让人有点同情的 01/18 00:29
188F:→ jazzlamb:太多人先预设立场再单方面解释,我觉得并不是很理性... 01/18 00:29
189F:→ renlin:譬如他们回去跟朋友宣传这件事之类的= =" 01/18 00:29
190F:推 yaopheasant:回j大,正因为我们不知道才需要另一个当事人来说明 01/18 00:29
191F:→ fakeayumi:小故事吗 = = 01/18 00:29
192F:推 xufunny:选择要离境的前两天沟通 这似乎有点说不过去唷 01/18 00:29
193F:推 yoorange:事实不重要,大家心中相信的正义会帮忙生出"客观"事实~~~ 01/18 00:29
194F:推 HuckleberryF:柯南是漫画.............. 01/18 00:30
195F:→ fakeayumi:喔 好啦 -.- 01/18 00:30
196F:→ yuhung:那是柯南 如果换杉下右京他会说无论如何都不应该犯法(扯远) 01/18 00:30
197F:→ yuhung:话说相棒真的不错看 台湾真的该引进 都播到第九季了 QQ 01/18 00:30
198F:→ yuhung:如果换赫丘里白罗 遇到东方快车的例子他会睁只眼闭只眼 01/18 00:31
199F:→ HuckleberryF:如果这两封都是 Emma 本人写的,那只看到她想为她的 01/18 00:31
200F:→ yaopheasant:但就过去很多社会事件案例来看,犯罪动机是的确会影响 01/18 00:31
201F:→ HuckleberryF:行为合理化而已 01/18 00:31
202F:→ fakeayumi:yuhung XDDD 01/18 00:31
203F:推 hanachan:想问...Emma说接受了媒体采访,她到底离台了没啊? 01/18 00:31
204F:推 newsboy3423:几个疑点 1.nqc 到底有无一直敲墙壁? 2.阳台那张照片 01/18 00:32
205F:→ yaopheasant:整个社会对事件的观感跟法官的判决... 01/18 00:32
206F:推 gilthoniel22:好长= = 都烦了 01/18 00:32
207F:→ jokerjoe:选择要离境的前两天深夜爬窗沟通 这似乎有点说不过去喔^^ 01/18 00:32
208F:→ HuckleberryF:因为这些原因(她认为)所以她当时会有拖人踹共的行为 01/18 00:33
209F:→ newsboy3423:是基於何种理由而拍? 01/18 00:33
210F:→ kameilove:jokerjoe他有说是因为他当天看到隔壁从窗户看自己 01/18 00:33
211F:推 alohayo:如果真是原苦主把事情夸张化造成这些风波.... 01/18 00:33
212F:→ HuckleberryF:一般人又不是决定刑度的人,她这两篇文章只是想让人 01/18 00:33
213F:→ dsmwang:不需要再讨论到当天的爬窗有没有错,这大家都知道有错 01/18 00:33
214F:→ alohayo:不知道到时候她跟国企小坏坏的下场谁会比较惨..... 01/18 00:33
215F:→ newsboy3423:3."沟通"的时间点 4.宿舍管理员提起 曾想安排协商 01/18 00:34
216F:推 dabengo:为什麽有证人是在台籍学生这,和emma说的又不一样? 01/18 00:34
217F:→ dsmwang:但双方骚扰的行为是否属实,对大众观感的影响很大,应求证 01/18 00:34
218F:推 yuhung:看来是时候出动李昌钰回台协助台大办案了(误) 01/18 00:34
219F:→ HuckleberryF:同情, 敲墙壁?跟这事情有什麽关系 01/18 00:34
220F:推 jokerjoe:KAMEI 那他也不用叫好几个男人深夜来撞击+叫嚣吧 01/18 00:35
221F:推 yuuirain:推dsm 01/18 00:35
222F:→ newsboy3423:但 nqc拒绝 是否真实? 01/18 00:35
223F:嘘 chutzpah:还是有洞, 22:00至08:00不听techno, 但照样有可能放的是 01/18 00:35
224F:→ newsboy3423:5.台籍学生证人似乎有点少? 01/18 00:35
225F:推 andrewmai:推 01/18 00:36
226F:→ chutzpah:其他类型会吵到人的音乐, 不听techno改听heavy metal吗? 01/18 00:36
227F:→ HuckleberryF:拍照搞不好是学生喜欢自拍纪念,国内国外都有人把 01/18 00:36
228F:推 phoenix13:很怀疑到底有多少人把文章看完? 01/18 00:37
229F:→ HuckleberryF:自己做的蠢事拍照拍影片上传到网路後,才被人肉 01/18 00:37
230F:→ newsboy3423:但在这种情况下 会有这种心情吗.... 01/18 00:37
231F:→ dsmwang:解释会不会拍照意义不大,她拍照的动机不影响照片真假 01/18 00:37
232F:→ dsmwang:除非有人能指出照片伪造,不然照片上呈现的仍是事实 01/18 00:37
233F:推 yoorange:对於H大来说,邓如雯他老公家暴似乎也啥关系~~~~~~~~~~~~ 01/18 00:38
234F:→ akilo:囧 H大你护航护的有点超过... 01/18 00:38
235F:→ newsboy3423:还有 他们离开的速度 似乎很快?(据太子方说法) 01/18 00:38
236F:→ HuckleberryF:邓如雯她老公家暴跟这事情是没关系啊 01/18 00:38
237F:→ saigxx:nqc应该不会说有没敲墙壁吧 这样死无对证更玄阿~ 01/18 00:39
238F:→ HuckleberryF:说人护航的有没有搞清楚事情的重点 01/18 00:39
239F:→ dsmwang:不要讨论什麽家暴了吧,焦点会被转移。 01/18 00:39
240F:→ yoorange:嗯嗯嗯对对对,我就是要看你讲出这句话,这样就够了~~~~~ 01/18 00:39
241F:推 yaopheasant:有点忘了是谁说过的话,如果一个情人劈腿绝对是他的 01/18 00:40
242F:→ yaopheasant:问题,但连续三个情人劈腿似乎就该想想自己了 01/18 00:40
243F:推 jokerjoe:我觉得nqc就算有敲墙壁 深夜带男人爬窗叫嚣就是狂输一场 01/18 00:40
244F:推 juju6326:原po无辜 01/18 00:40
245F:→ chutzpah:"but every time I speak she knocks" 与 normal speak 01/18 00:41
246F:→ dsmwang:爬窗错归错,我们仍想知道nqc有没有半夜敲墙壁之类的行为 01/18 00:41
247F:→ yaopheasant:所以我觉得Emma是一定有错,但原po也该出来解释些什麽 01/18 00:41
248F:推 OGCKM:出来道歉还附图 算有一点诚意打算解释了 不过一开始对质 01/18 00:41
249F:推 jazzlamb:推dsmwang 01/18 00:41
250F:→ OGCKM:不是更好 01/18 00:41
251F:→ closmaloud:这篇文感觉起来Emma并不认为自己有错 01/18 00:42
252F:推 newsboy3423:个人倾向 两方都有错 01/18 00:42
253F:→ dsmwang:Emma有没有错校规会处置、大众也会有舆论,不是Emma说了算 01/18 00:42
254F:推 ortho:Emma的错被检讨完了 现在该换nqc踹共了吧?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 01/18 00:42
255F:→ newsboy3423:nqc 能否说明一下? 代人转贴也好嘛 01/18 00:43
256F:推 probono:推楼上 01/18 00:43
257F:推 innovated:同意newsboy大 双方可能都有错只是双方都避开谈自己的错 01/18 00:44
258F:推 dabengo:EMMA在昨天版主代po的文章说他们当晚轻声细语敲门 01/18 00:44
259F:推 shtmn:我觉得是Emma在保护失控的人... 01/18 00:44
260F:→ dabengo:和证人说的完全不一样 01/18 00:45
261F:→ innovated:感觉回国的是nqc.... 01/18 00:45
262F:→ dsmwang:在宏观上,要求太子和学校的制度改革仍是主轴。 01/18 00:45
263F:推 puff12320:推楼上 01/18 00:45
264F:推 rsggsr:纯推nqc踹共!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 01/18 00:45
265F:推 yuuirain:感觉回国的是nqc XD 01/18 00:45
266F:→ dsmwang:但就这个事件而言,双方说法出入点仍很多,有待厘清。 01/18 00:46
267F:推 flypig7882:nqc!nqc!nqc!nqc!nqc!nqc!nqc!nqc!nqc! 01/18 00:46
268F:推 gwenpig:学校 BOT OIA 学生会 EMMA都出来说了 真相还原只剩NQC了 01/18 00:46
269F:→ puff12320:我可不想要这件事情被河蟹阿~"~ 01/18 00:46
270F:推 jokerjoe:emma这封信内容就是强调nqc敏感+帮邱新皓护航啊 01/18 00:46
271F:→ dsmwang:只能希望双方都能更愿意把自己的观点发表出来,让大家知道 01/18 00:46
272F:推 akanokuruma:这两个人上下左右都没室友吗..... 01/18 00:47
273F:→ jokerjoe:可能是邱新皓拜托她写的也不一定喔^^(我自己的猜测而已) 01/18 00:47
274F:推 rainanny:PEACE 01/18 00:47
275F:→ jokerjoe:之前证人不是说EMMA再被多次检举之後制造噪音变本加厉? 01/18 00:47
276F:→ puff12320:下次应该生活习惯类似的住一起啦 隔音又不是很好 01/18 00:47
277F:嘘 TSMCboy:国企甲甲秋都不出来喔 是不是男人 01/18 00:48
278F:推 catmiaow:很奇怪大家怎麽都不太讨论nqc也从窗户看爱玛那一段,很有 01/18 00:48
279F:→ akanokuruma:不过老实说这真的是外国人写的吗 XD? 01/18 00:48
280F:→ catmiaow:八卦点,也很具张力呢~~~ 01/18 00:48
281F:→ dsmwang:原来还有人战性向...拜托稳重一点,要帮他留下发言的空间 01/18 00:48
282F:→ chutzpah:Emma多次强调正常(normal), 那他的正常是否合规定(legal) 01/18 00:49
283F:推 yaopheasant:TSM大,人家有名有姓的,不需要做人身攻击 01/18 00:49
284F:→ jokerjoe:nqc之前有提到是为了捡抹布?emma觉得她是偷看她在不在 01/18 00:49
285F:推 newsboy3423:别战性向 01/18 00:49
286F:推 linesa:有没有emma的真相XD 01/18 00:49
287F:推 dabengo:昨天证人说他分得出来声音的情形;有谁觉得emma一直造假? 01/18 00:50
288F:→ jokerjoe:linesa之前有图啊XDDD 01/18 00:50
289F:→ dsmwang:这不是一方真一方假的状况,很有可能双方对状况的认知不同 01/18 00:51
290F:→ dsmwang:nqc觉得很吵不是假话,Emma觉得很小声也是真话 01/18 00:51
291F:推 ieng2000:她说自己很安静,但实情是不是这样,怎样才算是吵,各说各话 01/18 00:51
292F:→ newsboy3423:还是想听听 更多邻居的说词 01/18 00:52
293F:→ HuckleberryF:就算假设两方都是真的,互相制造噪音 01/18 00:52
294F:→ dabengo:因为昨天他请版主的文章说他们轻轻敲门请台生出来 01/18 00:52
295F:→ HuckleberryF:有烙人来叫对方踹共的只有 Emma 01/18 00:52
296F:→ jokerjoe:然後证人说听到恐怖撞击声赶快打给柜台 01/18 00:52
297F:→ satsuki0207:那个敲门照片中的黑发男子,就是可爱的邱学弟嘛?XD 01/18 00:52
298F:嘘 TSMCboy:性向有甚麽好战? 本来就甲甲 01/18 00:52
299F:→ dsmwang:但不能因此推断Emma说的其他话就是假的。这不合逻辑。 01/18 00:52
300F:→ satsuki0207:我觉得这照片超好笑的,事後在演什麽演阿 01/18 00:53
301F:→ HuckleberryF:另外就是还没人举证 nqc也会制造噪音吵到同楼层 01/18 00:53
302F:→ dabengo:证人说 01/18 00:53
303F:推 rainlingring:捡抹布的说法太牵强了吧....那可是九楼耶!! 01/18 00:53
304F:→ dabengo:善意的敲门跟那种想要把门敲到烂的敲法我分得出来好吗!!? 01/18 00:53
305F:→ satsuki0207:以为在拍玫瑰瞳铃眼喔 01/18 00:53
306F:→ newsboy3423:不要一直提性向 够了啦... 你要讲 私下讲 01/18 00:53
307F:推 genuine530:我想这封信应该有真有假...可能之前的事是真的但是後来 01/18 00:53
308F:→ newsboy3423:在这种讨论场合 恩..... 01/18 00:54
309F:推 ieng2000:供辞所谓的"静"与"正常生活"之类,都由她说的 01/18 00:54
310F:→ genuine530:闹到的事情讲出实情又会站不住脚..... 01/18 00:54
311F:→ HuckleberryF:善意找人沟通,不会刻意找己方的人,而是找第三方 01/18 00:54
312F:→ dabengo:他会说那种谎(如果证人所说为真),那他的立场就是要造假啊 01/18 00:54
313F:→ ieng2000:可能她觉得讲个skype,在房间与朋友聚会,甚至喝啤酒, 01/18 00:54
314F:推 hanachan:九月的时候Emma说希望小天使可以用中文帮她跟nqc沟通,都 01/18 00:54
315F:→ HuckleberryF:才能让两边坐下来谈, Emma 的作为不是 01/18 00:55
316F:嘘 TSMCboy:那你就不要再讲阿 提甚麽提 你是他的谁阿 01/18 00:55
317F:→ kameilove:他不是找过很多次第三方无效了吗?????????? 01/18 00:55
318F:→ ieng2000:都没吵到人,但事实又是否如此呢? 01/18 00:55
319F:→ dsmwang:他觉得很客气,证人和nqc觉得很凶猛,这也是可能的状况 01/18 00:55
320F:→ hanachan:小天使有帮忙沟通协调吗? 01/18 00:55
321F:→ dsmwang:我不是在护航,我只是要说一方真,不代表另一方就是假 01/18 00:56
322F:推 monologue:也可能他们趁着酒意根本不觉得自己有多大声 01/18 00:56
323F:→ jokerjoe:他有帮忙用流利中文"协调"^^ 01/18 00:56
324F:→ dabengo:dam大,你说这我觉得或许有点不合理了 01/18 00:56
325F:→ dsmwang:要考虑到双方在认知上的差异。恶意推论对厘清真相帮助不大 01/18 00:56
326F:→ dabengo:EMMA昨天的文章确实说他们是"轻轻敲门"请他出来 01/18 00:56
327F:→ ieng2000:坦白说,她觉得自己还算客气,未免太超过了 01/18 00:57
328F:→ dabengo:证人是说 01/18 00:57
329F:推 jokerjoe:她醉了 01/18 00:57
330F:→ dabengo:善意的敲门跟那种想要把门敲到烂的敲法我分得出来好吗!!? 01/18 00:57
331F:→ HuckleberryF:半夜 那麽多人 "轻轻敲门" 请人出来? 沟通? 01/18 00:57
332F:推 kadolyc:XD 01/18 00:58
333F:→ dabengo:这还要说是认知上的差异就太不合理了 01/18 00:58
334F:→ dsmwang:证人和nqc说法一致,因此我比较相信他们真的很大声 01/18 00:58
335F:→ ieng2000:而且她把那男生的话翻成英文,好像都说得很客气那样, 01/18 00:58
336F:→ dsmwang:但是这在Emma耳中可能觉得不算很大声 01/18 00:59
337F:→ ieng2000:可是嘛....这分明是有心掩饰 01/18 00:59
338F:→ dabengo:所以我才觉得如果证人所说为真,那emma立场就是在造假那边 01/18 00:59
339F:→ dsmwang:我只是说不需要推论到某方说法全都是捏造的 01/18 00:59
340F:→ minakyle:推认知差异~加上那晚他们喝了酒~酒後态度难免跟平常不同 01/18 00:59
341F:→ dsmwang:Emma掩饰事件的音量,不代表之前的骚扰不存在 01/18 00:59
342F:→ minakyle:也许他们始终认知"想沟通的出发点"是好的~但带着酒後的情 01/18 01:00
343F:→ dabengo:那个证人是隔着门也 太夸张的认知差异 01/18 01:00
344F:→ HuckleberryF:除了那男的会中文,那他讲的中文只有他能翻成英文 01/18 01:00
345F:→ ieng2000:基本上问柜台,他们到底有没有说要帮忙搬东西,就知她的 01/18 01:00
346F:→ ieng2000:可信性 01/18 01:00
347F:→ dsmwang:不管是要全盘否定Emma或nqc,我都觉得没道理 01/18 01:00
348F:→ dabengo:我没说不存在和全部都是捏造的啊 01/18 01:00
349F:→ minakyle:绪~他们只记得他们"好的出发点"却忘记他们的"行为"太夸张 01/18 01:00
350F:→ dsmwang:一件件事情分开来,这件事可能某方对,另一件事可能不是 01/18 01:01
351F:→ dabengo:我是说emma如果有造假(如果证人所说为真),立场就是造假 01/18 01:01
352F:→ ieng2000:可是"想沟通的出发点",是事件的原因?还是事後的藉口? 01/18 01:01
353F:→ eric780105:拍了照而且还摆pose..应该是觉得很好玩才会拍照 的吧 01/18 01:02
354F:→ minakyle:是事前事後~那就不是我们这些非当事人能马上推敲出来的了 01/18 01:02
355F:→ dsmwang:如果你说他在事情发生时的音量描述错很大,那我不至於反对 01/18 01:02
356F:→ dsmwang:但是说造假...可能就有些过了。 01/18 01:02
357F:→ chtm:看起来是避重就轻 想合理化自己一行人的行为 01/18 01:03
358F:→ HuckleberryF:有人真的认为 半夜 烙人来 真的"轻轻敲门" 01/18 01:03
359F:→ dabengo:他文章说轻轻敲门和证人的所说之差异,就是一方在扭曲是非 01/18 01:03
360F:→ HuckleberryF:请人出来沟通。 碰到这情形会开门的人真的很有胆识 01/18 01:04
361F:→ dabengo:如果不是有一方不是造假不就很怪 01/18 01:04
362F:→ HuckleberryF:再说事前有什麽恩怨要解释 跟校方及管理单位去说 01/18 01:04
363F:→ dsmwang:我自己倾向於用认知不同来解释,你认为Emma造假我也没意见 01/18 01:05
364F:→ dsmwang:只是不要让这件事的立场影响其他事情的判断就好。 01/18 01:05
365F:→ HuckleberryF:反正两造的说法都是从自身出发,但无关烙人轻轻敲门 01/18 01:05
366F:→ dabengo:请别乱说,我都有说如果证人所说为真 01/18 01:06
367F:→ HuckleberryF:至於平常到底是谁比较吵,应该也会问同楼层的人 01/18 01:06
368F:→ dabengo:然後那种说法的不同说是认知差异我觉得就不合理啊 01/18 01:06
369F:→ dsmwang:嗯,你可以觉得不合理啊,我尊重你。但我自己不是这样解释 01/18 01:07
370F:→ dsmwang:但是我们的共识是Emma方应该是发出了蛮大的声音 01/18 01:08
371F:推 ieng2000:如果摔门声量都被第三者形容为恐怖,而她还可以觉得 01/18 01:08
372F:推 b98901056:爆 01/18 01:08
373F:→ ieng2000:这不过是轻轻敲门,那不管她的听力与认知有没有受酒精影响 01/18 01:08
374F:→ dsmwang:这个讨论太细了,认知差异合不合理每个人自有判断 01/18 01:09
375F:→ dsmwang:你们觉得不合理亦可,我觉得合理亦可。我们能否讨论别的? 01/18 01:09
376F:→ HuckleberryF:我只有认为烙人来门前是不对的,有没有发出蛮大的 01/18 01:09
377F:推 SaraScofield:终於看完信了好长 01/18 01:09
378F:→ ieng2000:,这很难不让人质疑她之前一直强调的"自己很静","正常音量 01/18 01:09
379F:推 xhungx:看了这文就会觉得是nqc很可怕 01/18 01:09
380F:→ HuckleberryF:声音,我不清楚,但找人来这件事 Emma自己都认了 01/18 01:09
381F:→ ieng2000:"的说法,而且後来播音乐播到全走廊都听到,又如何解释呢? 01/18 01:10
382F:→ dsmwang:找人来是错的这个Emma信内有提到,学校也会有处置 01/18 01:10
383F:推 dabengo:如果再没有对质,双方一直po文的话,那会浪费大家多少时间 01/18 01:10
384F:→ minakyle:我推ieng大~我觉得没有很多人着墨的"酒精"也是一个关键 01/18 01:11
385F:→ FLEBILE:Emma的"正常音量"是无差别攻击到苦主以外的其他邻居耶.... 01/18 01:11
386F:推 capri75:===========寒假时间太多 来打打嘴炮正好================ 01/18 01:11
387F:推 mimihi:证人有说 他一开始没听到 是後来EMMA似乎被投诉到烦 01/18 01:13
388F:推 ieng2000:去睡了,无谓为此事伤肝,远因只能说BOT的烂隔音 01/18 01:13
389F:→ mimihi:才故意反击回去 01/18 01:13
390F:→ ieng2000:那她就不要说自己一直都很静... 01/18 01:15
391F:→ FLEBILE:证人一开始没听到是因为有开窗户~ 01/18 01:15
392F:推 xxp680:看完了 比较同情emma一点 但不能说谁对谁错 01/18 01:21
393F:推 shenarthur:http://0rz.tw/3RZWT 要正视这个问题!!! 01/18 01:21
394F:推 yaopheasant:F大所说证人是因为开窗户才没听到,我记得是他的推测 01/18 01:27
395F:→ chutzpah:还有送耳塞, 没说清楚这会让对方认为挑衅吧? 01/18 01:28
396F:推 jack5914qoo:Emma那封信写得有点太直让人感受不太到善意 而且似乎 01/18 01:32
397F:→ jack5914qoo:讲明自己时差的问题 01/18 01:32
398F:→ alibrandi:其实我觉得那封信不会没有善意 很多外国人用英文讲话本 01/18 01:33
399F:→ alibrandi:来就是直白 不像东方人习惯包装得很委婉 01/18 01:33
400F:→ Ryanhs:结论是台大人英文真好~!!! 01/18 01:37
401F:推 TTHsimon:我感觉拍照时的氛围是嘻嘻哈哈的 想秀给朋友看 01/18 01:41
402F:→ chutzpah:台湾的人英文本来就不差, 只是被发音迷思啦! 01/18 01:41
403F:推 Buchladen:我只觉得辅导员也是一个关键角色 01/18 01:45
404F:推 Kenneth1225:如果我的室友真如本文所说 我也会崩溃.... 01/18 01:45
405F:推 yurihou:刚刚给我哥看照片 我哥说这明明就很可怕啊="= 01/18 01:45
406F:→ jack5914qoo:对 ali说得没错 所以我是用"太直" 而不是挑衅之类的 01/18 01:47
407F:→ jack5914qoo:这在东方人和西方人的语言表达上确实有差异 01/18 01:48
iwanttoknow:转录至看板 NTU_BOTDorm 01/18 01:55
408F:→ chutzpah:Emma当初没有亲自沟通或请通译甚至小天使转译, 这叫所谓 01/18 01:57
409F:→ chutzpah:"西方式的直接"? 自己当初没有用心处理, 就不要拿文化 01/18 01:58
410F:→ chutzpah:来虎烂! 01/18 01:59
411F:→ dsmwang:并不是说面对面就是用心;非面对面也不代表不用心 01/18 01:59
412F:→ dsmwang:觉得用不用心,看信件内容後再评断还比较有理一点。 01/18 02:01
413F:推 capri75:chut需要看翻译吗? 不然看完这篇再说吧 Emma明明就有写信 01/18 02:03
414F:→ capri75:沟通 ~_~ 01/18 02:03
415F:→ chutzpah:抱歉我是先用搜寻可能争议字眼 01/18 02:08
416F:→ chutzpah:capri75你对, 还附图.... 01/18 02:09
417F:→ chutzpah:不看信还好, 一看就看到"Why not use NTU's beautiful 01/18 02:10
418F:→ chutzpah:library?" 自己不先质疑所有可能侵权的行为, 先检讨别人? 01/18 02:12
419F:→ capri75:先假设Emma所言属实 那麽如果你在房间里的活动属於正常音 01/18 02:13
420F:→ capri75:量 但你邻居是个对於声音极度敏感的人 那你应该要怎麽做呢 01/18 02:14
421F:→ capri75:至於Emma自认为的"正常音量"合理与否 就有待证人来厘清了 01/18 02:15
422F:推 tear0512:建议她去总图读书XD 01/18 02:15
423F:→ capri75:如果是我遇到这麽敏感的邻居 也会请她去图书馆 @@ 01/18 02:15
424F:→ capri75:但我觉得总图也不算很安静 光是高跟鞋声音就会让我很不爽 01/18 02:16
425F:→ capri75:何况还有咳嗽醒鼻涕转笔按滑鼠等等 ~_~ 01/18 02:16
426F:推 leighmeow:推 01/18 02:29
427F:推 albirex:如果不能接受任何声音,不如住山上! 01/18 02:30
428F:→ albirex:住宿舍的一个学习点就是学会跟别人相处啊!!! 01/18 02:31
429F:→ albirex:不然出到社会要怎麽办?? 01/18 02:32
430F:→ albirex:本人也住隔音差的BOT!真要念书有总图和耳机! 01/18 02:35
431F:→ albirex:又不是没办法!除非是想闹事!这种就是attention-seeking! 01/18 02:36
432F:→ chutzpah:回 capri75: 开音乐与使用 skype不是自己认为音量正常 01/18 02:39
433F:→ chutzpah:就正常, 开音乐可以带耳机, 用 skype可以打字, 还有其他 01/18 02:40
434F:→ chutzpah:公共场所. 其他: 开关门, 开吹风机, 咳嗽, 至少我觉得 01/18 02:43
435F:→ capri75:问题是如果你在房间内以正常音量讲话也会被邻居嫌吵 那是 01/18 02:45
436F:→ capri75:不是就不能讲话了呢? 01/18 02:45
437F:→ chutzpah:这三件事的确是寝室内无可避免的声音.... 01/18 02:45
438F:→ chutzpah:很抱歉, 我要手机时就会离开室内, 除非那天我的邻居都 01/18 02:47
439F:→ chutzpah:回家或出门了 01/18 02:47
440F:→ chutzpah:因为我明白听到笑话我会笑出来, 而且我也只在星巴克, 01/18 02:49
441F:→ chutzpah:麦当劳用 skype, 不过近年不常用. 01/18 02:50
442F:推 tear0512:楼上SKYPE的地点很奇怪 一般人会想在自己房间吧 01/18 02:51
443F:→ capri75:哪我实在佩服chut...我无法做到在正常时间 正常音量的情 01/18 02:52
444F:→ capri75:况下还要迁就邻居 到外面讲话 01/18 02:52
445F:→ chutzpah:什麽是正常音量? 抱歉我不是国家标准制定者 01/18 02:54
446F:→ chutzpah:回 tear0512: 吵杂的公共场所, 至少连旁边的人都在吵, 01/18 02:57
447F:→ chutzpah:比较不容易落人口实吧? 01/18 02:57
448F:→ chutzpah:回 capri75: 感谢总图的训练, 所以手机一震动就是往外冲 01/18 02:58
449F:推 capri75:http://tinyurl.com/2locu 这里有正常谈话的音量 01/18 03:01
450F:→ chutzpah:抱歉您或许家里有仪器, 但是我穷, 所以不可能常常看仪器 01/18 03:02
451F:→ chutzpah:而且"香港环保署"对"台大"有管辖权吗 01/18 03:04
452F:推 capri75:我只想表示正常音量不是那麽难以理解的概念 01/18 03:04
453F:→ capri75:我更没提到管辖权 只是引用科学上的数据 01/18 03:04
454F:→ capri75:那我改用http://ivy1.epa.gov.tw/noise/BB/B-04-01.htm 01/18 03:06
455F:→ capri75:印表机:50分贝 人平常讲话声音:60分贝 电话铃声:70分贝 01/18 03:07
456F:→ capri75:采相对概念应该就不难理解了吧 :) 01/18 03:07
457F:→ chutzpah:重点不是我理不理解吧? 是我做得到不要吵到人就去做, 01/18 03:10
458F:→ chutzpah:这与国籍无关喔? 我就有个来自美国长老教会的朋友, 讲 01/18 03:11
459F:→ chutzpah:手机也是会远离人, 先尊重人, 再谈文化特色甚至差异 01/18 03:11
460F:→ chutzpah:还有, 虽然我怕吵到别人, 但是别人吵到我, 我是用我自己 01/18 03:13
461F:→ capri75:好吧 没有交集 至少我在BOT是可以在房内轻松跟朋友谈天的 01/18 03:13
462F:→ chutzpah:戴了耳道式耳机听歌後还听得到对方的声音为准 01/18 03:14
463F:→ capri75:也问过邻居 没有意见 End 01/18 03:14
464F:→ chutzpah:我也没有说你错, 至少你愿意徵求邻居意见, Emma有吗? 01/18 03:14
465F:→ chutzpah:说邻居严肃, 问邻居为什麽不去图书馆, 送耳塞, 为什麽 01/18 03:16
466F:→ capri75:我只想坚持一点 在非睡眠时间的私人空间内 制造出非违法 01/18 03:16
467F:→ chutzpah:不找可翻译的同学与管理人员当中间人? 01/18 03:16
468F:→ capri75:的声音音量 我不认为需要如此迁就邻居 01/18 03:16
469F:→ capri75:问题就在於辅导员跟柜台没有善尽"协调"的责任 01/18 03:17
470F:→ chutzpah:但若因此有环保署(白天)警察(晚上)敲门, 所谓个人认为 01/18 03:18
471F:→ chutzpah:就需要再审视一次吧? 01/18 03:18
472F:推 capri75:"不到违法标准的音量"就已经排除官方干涉的可能性了... 01/18 03:19
473F:→ chutzpah:也是. 01/18 03:20
474F:→ capri75:抱歉 先睡了 @@" 01/18 03:21
475F:推 wensday:我看完信了,但她的信没有什麽新东西啊!还是一样半夜揪人闯 01/18 03:39
476F:→ wensday:入叫人揣共啊!她怎麽说她们没想伤害人有什麽用?而且她一直 01/18 03:40
477F:→ wensday:说她怕苦主所以都不敢出声,动作都超轻,那其他邻居说她音乐 01/18 03:41
478F:→ wensday:放很大声关门很大声是见鬼了?这根本不是她中文不好无法辩 01/18 03:42
479F:→ wensday:解的部份 01/18 03:42
480F:→ chutzpah:这封信当中还有其他人的文字纪录, 都徵求同意吗? 01/18 03:50
481F:→ wensday:她的辩解完全像个国中生会说的话 01/18 04:01
482F:推 alicehsin:umm.. 事情总是有两面的 01/18 06:01
483F:推 anika:就事论事 假设苦主真是如此 那艾玛都忍到学期末 为何要在离 01/18 06:15
484F:→ anika:开前 跟其他所谓的好朋友一起作这种事? 要谈自己谈 晚上11点 01/18 06:16
485F:→ anika:一个诡异白人男子敲你窗户 前方还有这麽呛的史地文 就是解决 01/18 06:17
486F:推 anika:问题的好方法吗? 两封自白看了都在废话 不承认当晚的行为 01/18 06:20
487F:→ anika:就是错了!一直提到苦主怎样所以他才这样 无限回圈 01/18 06:20
488F:→ wensday:而且那个白人男子看起来真的很可怕..我看照片都吓到了 01/18 06:44
489F:推 bluebluelan:乂煞气a新皓乂 01/18 07:10
490F:→ dragon159753:这种事拥有两方的故事,这里嘘的人啊...别那麽无聊 01/18 07:23
491F:→ dragon159753:的一直挑他的信,especially chutzpah =.=" 01/18 07:23
492F:推 RealJustice:她的字好丑 不如国中生 这样的人读NTU? 唉... 01/18 07:47
493F:→ dragon159753:realjustice: 写字跟读书能力有甚麽关西?? 01/18 09:43
494F:嘘 Jinbei:beat around the bush 01/18 09:51
495F:推 lilypai60821:昨天读这读到好晚= = 01/18 10:22
496F:推 needfood:会写这封信表示 她不是胆子很大就是把台湾看的很扁 01/18 10:59
497F:→ needfood:把大家当笨蛋? 01/18 10:59
498F:嘘 DarthSidiou:把大家当笨蛋,用英文写解释得清深夜叫人踹共是何居心 01/18 12:11
499F:推 philip77:推~~~ 01/18 12:20
500F:嘘 bluemidnight:一堆废话 01/18 12:34
501F:嘘 jn8029:快推 不然丹麦人以为我们看不懂英文 01/18 12:56
502F:推 a801393:啧啧..英文信就没人推了XDD?! 01/18 14:22
503F:推 a1550301221:哀 01/18 16:02
504F:嘘 abrandnewme:可以不要再模糊焦点了嘛!! 重点是带人骚扰好不好!!! 01/18 16:34
505F:→ abrandnewme:一直强调不会中文 难道你有试着用英文沟通吗?!!! 01/18 16:35
506F:嘘 sparkle0829:then? 01/18 17:02
507F:嘘 lovpeace:照片很有趣 甚麽样的人会边跑到人家窗边敲门 边在旁边拍 01/18 17:06
508F:→ lovpeace:照? 温柔且善意的沟通? 我看是故意闹人拍照留念吧... 01/18 17:06
509F:嘘 Edger:拍窗子的、恐吓的部分咧 搞不清楚重点 01/18 17:33
510F:→ gausong:没错 我也很怀疑为什麽要拍照 如果是温柔且善意的沟通 01/18 17:34
511F:推 gity1208:帮补血推 01/18 17:39
512F:推 blueright061:补血推 01/18 17:54
513F:推 yushiung:推读玩了 01/18 20:29
514F:推 elephants31:百推 01/18 22:42
515F:嘘 ws1008taiwan:企图不良给嘘. 01/18 22:45
516F:嘘 noway:plz in CHINESE 01/18 23:05
517F:嘘 clover929:有骚扰就是有骚扰啊..... 01/18 23:47
518F:推 Armor564:试论嘘/推的人,10个里面,真正看完的有没有5个? 01/19 03:25
519F:→ Armor564:不管发生了啥事,超过访客时间烙人就是不对-->乡民的逻辑 01/19 03:27
520F:嘘 mkchiun1028:我看完了,楼上呢? 01/19 08:34
521F:→ katsurada:我还是觉得叫朋友去跟人"沟通"很不合理啊... 01/19 10:06
522F:嘘 helloken2006:我看完了 Armor那句有甚麽问题 请提高见 少放炮 01/19 10:08
523F:推 jasonfghx:推 01/20 08:26
524F:推 illidan23: 01/20 20:23
525F:嘘 chutzpah:"乡民的逻辑"有什麽问题? 若歧视乡民可自以为优越吗? 01/21 04:40
526F:嘘 ian60702:英文 01/21 12:24
527F:嘘 jm7908: 05/26 18:57
528F:嘘 jm7908: 05/27 18:55







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